<HTML><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10>Subj:	<B> Traveller-digest V1999 #1337</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10></B><BR>
Date:	11/11/99 1:48:47 PM Pacific Standard Time<BR>
From:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
Sender:	owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Reply-to:	traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
To:	traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
</FONT><FONT  SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
Traveller-digest    Thursday, November 11 1999    Volume 1999 : Number 1337<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
RE: Recovering disabled grav vehicles<BR>
RE: Gritty, X-Files-like scenario<BR>
Re: Pacifist groups in the 3I<BR>
Re: (OT) IN TIME FOR REMEMBRANCE......<BR>
Re: (OT) IN TIME FOR REMEMBRANCE......<BR>
Re: Travshorts II<BR>
Re: How to do a gritty, X-Files-like scenario?<BR>
Re: Starlost<BR>
Arts in Trav (fwd)<BR>
Re: How to do a gritty, X-Files-like scenario?<BR>
Pacifist groups in the 3I<BR>
Re: Cultures<BR>
Re: Travshorts II<BR>
Re: Recovering disabled grav vehicles<BR>
Re: Cultures<BR>
Re: Anti-violence groups in 3I<BR>
Re: Recovering disabled grav vehicles<BR>
Re: (OT) IN TIME FOR REMEMBRANCE......<BR>
Re: Recovering disabled grav vehicles<BR>
Recovering disabled grav vehicles<BR>
Re: Travshorts II<BR>
Re: Cultures<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 16:49:26 -0000<BR>
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com><BR>
Subject: RE: Recovering disabled grav vehicles<BR>
<BR>
Shadow wrote:<BR>
> Wireless control on a battlefield is *not* a good idea. And<BR>
> it's not as if using wires to connect the modules to the ARV is<BR>
> going to be *that* much of a pain.<BR>
<BR>
I suppose the "pain" issue depends on how  "hot"  the  recoveries<BR>
are.<BR>
<BR>
However, I wonder how easy it would be to  'simply  attach'  grav<BR>
modules to a battle damaged vehicle.  Then there's the  issue  of<BR>
bits  falling  off  mid-flight.   I  think  easiest  would  be  a<BR>
specialised recovery vehicle looking like a hovering WW2  landing<BR>
craft with a crane (to move the damaged vehicle and its bits onto<BR>
it).  It could double up as a general utility combat cargo mover.<BR>
<BR>
Regards PLST<BR>
"Proverb: Foolish are those who play Twister on the stairs."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 12:19:16 -0500<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: RE: Gritty, X-Files-like scenario<BR>
<BR>
Robert Eaglestone writes:<BR>
<snipped><BR>
>Suppose you want to give your players the creeps?  Send<BR>
>shivers up their spine?  Worry the PCs to no end?<BR>
><BR>
>How do you set it up?<BR>
<BR>
	Slowly.  I find that creepiness is best built up by<BR>
	small incriments, with the realization that something<BR>
	is VERY wrong only slowly coming to the PCs.<BR>
<BR>
>What factors do you have to think about?<BR>
<BR>
	Avoid open combat of any sort.  PCs always feel better<BR>
	after they've blown away some bad guys, but if they have<BR>
	drawn weapons several times without firing a shot they<BR>
	may begin to get antsy.<BR>
<BR>
<snipped><BR>
>Government cover-ups; megacorps crossing the line into<BR>
>dark experiments; medicines that create horrors; rumors<BR>
>and uncertainty about the Ancients and the Solomani<BR>
>Hypothesis; the Imperial Department of War... how does<BR>
>one fit things like these together into a coherent scenario<BR>
>that starts innocuously and turns into a monster of a situation?<BR>
<BR>
	I would start with something totally bizarre and gross<BR>
	(don't underestimate the power of making your PCs go <BR>
	"Eewww!"), and then built layers of scheming, deceit,<BR>
	and bad intent.  The upper layer may be merely a cover-up<BR>
	of some money-making scheme, which the PCs may get involved<BR>
	with (one way or another).  Getting in deeper, they may<BR>
	realize that the scheme is connected with a slavery ring,<BR>
	which is selling the occasional sophont to a laboratory,<BR>
	which is really a front for a "satanic" cult, which are<BR>
	being duped by nasties with Ancient's technology, who are<BR>
	actually evil mind-sucking spiders from another domension<BR>
	plotting to turn all living things into cattle!  Aha! Ha! Ha!<BR>
<BR>
	Ahem.  Yes, well, and don't forget parasites.  PCs hate<BR>
	parasites.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 12:22:54 -0500<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: Re: Pacifist groups in the 3I<BR>
<BR>
Jens Rydholm writes:<BR>
>I haven't done anything that extreme, but I've had local peace<BR>
>activists spraypaint "MURDERER" and other, more obscene slogans<BR>
>on the turrets of the PCs ships while it was in the starport<BR>
>bay (they broke in). It scared the players more than I intended,<BR>
<snipped><BR>
<BR>
	This kind of thing is really great to spring on really<BR>
	paranoid PCs (you know who you are).  I can think of a<BR>
	couple of players who would refuse to leave their ship<BR>
	after something like that!<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 12:35:46 -0500<BR>
From: "Lyle Youngblood" <lyley@gte.net><BR>
Subject: Re: (OT) IN TIME FOR REMEMBRANCE......<BR>
<BR>
As far as this incipient flame-war goes, please, guys, let's not go there.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 12:32:35 EST<BR>
From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>
Subject: Re: (OT) IN TIME FOR REMEMBRANCE......<BR>
<BR>
In honor of Veterans/Remembrance Day (and a way to bring this flame back to <BR>
Traveller), I have compiled a list of Veterans organizations in the third <BR>
Imperium:<BR>
<BR>
The Starburst for Extreme Heroism Society: Open to members of the Imperial <BR>
Armed Forces who have won the Starburst for Extreme Heroism.<BR>
<BR>
The Non Commissioned Officer's Association: Open to members of the Imperial <BR>
Armed Forces who have attained the ranks of E3 to E9.<BR>
<BR>
The Retired Officers Association: Open to members of the Imperial Armed <BR>
Forces who have served as commissioned officers in the Imperial Armed Forces.<BR>
<BR>
The Imperial Noble Veterans Association: Open to members of the Imperial <BR>
Armed Forces who are of noble rank (Social status B and above).<BR>
<BR>
The Imperial Veterans of the Peerage Association: Open to members of the <BR>
Imperial Armed Forces who are of noble rank of the peerage. (Social status D <BR>
and above).<BR>
<BR>
The Imperial Marine Corps Association: Open to members and former members of <BR>
the Imperial Marines.<BR>
<BR>
The Imperial Army Association: Open to members and former members of the <BR>
Imperial Army.<BR>
<BR>
The Imperial Navy Association: Open to members and former members of the <BR>
Imperial Navy.<BR>
<BR>
The Imperial Interstellar Scout Service Association: Open to members and <BR>
former members of the IISS.<BR>
<BR>
The Imperial Legion: Open to all retired members of the Imperial Armed Forces.<BR>
<BR>
The Veterans of Imperial Wars Association: Open to all retired members of <BR>
Imperial Armed Forces who have served in military campaigns.<BR>
<BR>
The Veterans of the Fifth Frontier War Society: Open to all members of <BR>
Imperial Armed Forces who have served in the Fifth Frontier War.<BR>
<BR>
The Veterans of the Solomani Rim War Society: Open to all former members of <BR>
Imperial Armed Forces who have served in the Solomani Rim War. NOTE: Despite <BR>
the use of anagathics and the long age spans of Vilani, membership is <BR>
severely down, and it is believed that this organization will cease to exist <BR>
within twenty years as all these Veterans will have passed away.<BR>
<BR>
The Vilani-Imperial Veterans Society: Open to all former members of Imperial <BR>
Armed Forces of Vilani descent.<BR>
<BR>
The Solomani-Imperial Veterans Society: Open to all former members of <BR>
Imperial Armed Forces of Solomani descent.<BR>
<BR>
The Hall of Heroes Society: Open to all former members of Imperial Armed <BR>
Forces of Aslan descent.<BR>
<BR>
The Society of the Fang: Open to all former members of Imperial Armed Forces <BR>
of Vargr descent.<BR>
<BR>
The Tuhuir of Blood: Open to all former members of Imperial Armed Forces of <BR>
Vegan descent.<BR>
<BR>
Thank you Veterans of the TML...<BR>
<BR>
Seth<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:42:13 +1300<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Travshorts II<BR>
<BR>
On 9 Nov 99, at 15:08, Juliean Galak wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> At 08:31 AM 11/9/99 -0600, you wrote:<BR>
> > >Go ahead and laugh, human. The Electron Liberation Front will have it's<BR>
> > >revenge!<BR>
> ><BR>
> >ELF, eh? I thought they were limited to aquatic operations.<BR>
> <BR>
> Mmm... Elf...  The other white meat....<BR>
<BR>
I always thought they counted as vegetable matter for dietary purposes.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:10:38 -0600<BR>
From: tim@premier.net<BR>
Subject: Re: How to do a gritty, X-Files-like scenario?<BR>
<BR>
Robert asked<BR>
<BR>
> Howdy folks, time for a question.<BR>
> <BR>
> Suppose you want to give your players the creeps?  Send<BR>
> shivers up their spine?  Worry the PCs to no end?<BR>
> <BR>
> How do you set it up?  What factors do you have to think<BR>
> about?  Likely it is some version of the Enigma, with some<BR>
> of The Push in it, right?  But vague categories don't help me<BR>
> very much.  I'm asking for inspiration.<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
Robert I.C.E puts out a book with the writers of COC called <BR>
something like How to Run a Horror game.  Go by your local <BR>
Gammimg store and see if you can get it.  Its the best sourace for <BR>
this info.  It covers every type of horror game you can imagaine <BR>
from Fantasy to S.F. from gore to thrillers.  Its the best GM aid I <BR>
have seen.  <BR>
<BR>
It gave me the idea to run a Traveller horror game, thats a <BR>
combination of Titatic and the Night of the Living Dead.  The big <BR>
passanger linner misjumps causing major problems with the ship's <BR>
systems, and choas occuars.  Worse though is the fact that <BR>
hundereds of the low berths passangers have turned into zombies.<BR>
<BR>
The plan is to see how well the players deal with a dead in space <BR>
ship, hunderds of dying passangers, and acourse the Zombies.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Tim Reynolds<BR>
tim@premier.net <BR>
www.premier.net/~tim <BR>
225-388-8883<BR>
- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
Getting an education was a bit like a communicable <BR>
sexual disease.  It made you unsuitable for <BR>
a lot of jobs and then you had the urge to pass it on.<BR>
<BR>
Terry Pratchett <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 10:10:52 -0800<BR>
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Starlost<BR>
<BR>
Via electronic medium on 11/11/99 5:59 AM, ian@vax2.concordia.ca wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> <snipped><BR>
>> Ellison was in a huge argument with a "professional"<BR>
>> (non-sci-fi) writer who thought a "backup computer" was<BR>
>> something that made the spaceship fly in reverse.<BR>
> <BR>
> Does that mean that we are going to need hydroponics<BR>
> for the power plant?<BR>
<BR>
One thought: Bulkheads. When one *really* must take a dump. <gd&r><BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:48:43 -0500 (EST)<BR>
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca><BR>
Subject: Arts in Trav (fwd)<BR>
<BR>
I don't think this made it to the list somehow, so I'm resending it.<BR>
Apologies if it gets double-posted.  Anyone else have this kind of trouble<BR>
recently?<BR>
<BR>
Chalres C.<BR>
<BR>
- ---------- Forwarded message ----------<BR>
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 15:18:37 -0500 (EST)<BR>
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca><BR>
To: Traveller-digest <owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Subject: Arts in Trav<BR>
<BR>
	Well, like someone else said, every time I think of this, my head<BR>
starts to spin with the endlessness of possibilities.  Consider how many<BR>
worlds there are with populations roughly equivalent to Earth's today. <BR>
Combine this with the technology they have available and there should be a<BR>
dizzying assortment of art forms including 2D, 3D and maybe<BR>
higher-dimensional art in the form of isographic holograms and so on.  But<BR>
that answer is not very helpful, so let me come up with a few funky<BR>
things that could be thrown into the TU:<BR>
<BR>
	Terraforming as Art:  This would be the high TL equivalent of<BR>
those giant sculptures and modern art projects where they modify<BR>
landscapes.  Sponsored by gigacredit art endowments, these art projects<BR>
modify coastlines with giant dams and/or canals, adjust the color of local<BR>
plant life by introducing genetically engineered viruses and so on.  Ice<BR>
caps are melted into fun new shapes with plasma torches, fast-growing<BR>
algea lend color to oceans, and so on.  Mostly done on low-population<BR>
worlds.  Smaller scale projects modify only a continent or sea, but the<BR>
result is usually visible from orbit.<BR>
<BR>
	Genetics as Art:  Highly illegal in the 3I, but practiced in less<BR>
anti-biotech areas is the practice of creating new and interesting<BR>
creatures as art.  One could make a genuine chimera or dragon or...other<BR>
things...<:-o A side possibility here is recreating "real life" versions<BR>
of famous artworks, including genuine burning giraffes, melting clocks or<BR>
whatever (That last is stolen from a story by Greg Egan :-) <BR>
<BR>
	Gravitics as Art:  Getting into less controversial territory,<BR>
gravitics should have a major impact on art and architecture with<BR>
"impossible" buildings (a la Escher), ominously suspended masses and<BR>
oscillating fleets of sculpture elements. Canonically, Darrian flame<BR>
sculpture is supposed to make use of gravitics (although personally I<BR>
consider that to be a nouveau-school fad :-). <BR>
	<BR>
Just some ideas...<BR>
<BR>
Charles C.	<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 11:45:44 -0700<BR>
From: cos 90 <cos90@powersurfr.com><BR>
Subject: Re: How to do a gritty, X-Files-like scenario?<BR>
<BR>
>Howdy folks, time for a question.<BR>
><BR>
>Suppose you want to give your players the creeps?  Send<BR>
>shivers up their spine?  Worry the PCs to no end?<BR>
><BR>
>How do you set it up?  What factors do you have to think<BR>
>about?  Likely it is some version of the Enigma, with some<BR>
>of The Push in it, right?  But vague categories don't help me<BR>
>very much.  I'm asking for inspiration.<BR>
><BR>
>Government cover-ups; megacorps crossing the line into<BR>
>dark experiments; medicines that create horrors; rumors<BR>
>and uncertainty about the Ancients and the Solomani<BR>
>Hypothesis; the Imperial Department of War... how does<BR>
>one fit things like these together into a coherent scenario<BR>
>that starts innocuously and turns into a monster of a situation?<BR>
<BR>
A great resource for this sort of thing is GURPS Illuminati, which<BR>
is generic enough to be useable in any role-playing environment, no<BR>
matter what rule set one is using. I successfully did a superhero<BR>
campaign -- set in the same universe as a handful of other campaigns<BR>
we did -- using Illuminati. The PCs wound up being pawns in a huge<BR>
conspiracy, a conspiracy with many layers so that when the players<BR>
solved one mystery, all it did was generate more questions.<BR>
<BR>
This could easily be done in an interstellar setting. You don't even<BR>
need to figure out all the details ahead of time -- just enough for<BR>
the PCs to become involved in, and maybe a little more. The important<BR>
thing is to keep them guessing, and get them to the point that they<BR>
begin to suspect that everything they know is wrong.<BR>
<BR>
One great fake-out I pulled on them: the Evil Corporation that they<BR>
were fighting against, in whose HQ they had been several times, was<BR>
an outfit called OmniTech. When the heroes finally decided to face off<BR>
against OmniTech once and for all, they went to the OmniTech building<BR>
and found... a completely different building, the offices of a toy<BR>
company. Suspicious, they went to a nearby phone booth and checked the<BR>
directory. No listing for OmniTech, but a listing, at that address, for<BR>
the Toy Company.<BR>
<BR>
It got to the point that the PCs didn't know who to trust or where<BR>
to turn... and by having the Enemy plant a few fake clues, I had some<BR>
of the PCs begin to suspect that one of the others was secretly working<BR>
for the Enemy.<BR>
<BR>
As I said, you can easily do this in a space game...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
     Glenn St-Germain  Edmonton, Alberta, Canada <BR>
cos90@powersurfr.com  http://plaza.powersurfr.com/glenn<BR>
        "There is no longer any normal to be"<BR>
                                 -- Gary Numan<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:46:04 -0500<BR>
From: Mark Urbin <eclipse@ultranet.com><BR>
Subject: Pacifist groups in the 3I<BR>
<BR>
"Carlos Alos-Ferrer" <carlos.alos-ferrer@univie.ac.at> bangs out with his toes:<BR>
[snip]<BR>
 >> >Does anyone have any firm anti-violence groups active in their<BR>
 >> >Traveller universe? What d they do? How does the Imperium<BR>
 >> >see them?<BR>
[snip]<BR>
 >During an old FTF adventure, I introduced a pacifist movement<BR>
 >following (partly) in spirit Yukio Mishima's ideas, vaguely linked<BR>
 >to buddist religion.<BR>
<BR>
Mishima linked with a pacifist movement?  That thought should cause seismic <BR>
activity in Japan!  The man had his own private army & thought that the <BR>
Emperor should take back the reins of government and rearm the nation.<BR>
<BR>
His own suicide was an act he had been rehearsing his entire adult <BR>
life.  Perhaps as an atonement for failing the physical to become a Devine <BR>
Wind pilot during the Great Pacific War.<BR>
<BR>
 >An Army without more weapons that those used for<BR>
 >ritual suicide, willing to die but not to kill, with the firm belief<BR>
 >that nobody has the right to take one life, except the own. They were<BR>
 >called "Life Fighters" or "Mishimans."<BR>
<BR>
Remember that Mishima used his sword on several unarmed soldiers prior to <BR>
his sucide.   He certainly was willing to fight & kill others.  His own <BR>
suicide was an act of grand theatre.<BR>
<BR>
Given all that, I think the concept is certainly interesting, and the name <BR>
could be the result of cultural drift and historical revisionism.<BR>
<BR>
Also remember that a 'Suicide Attack Squad' has been done.  Check out Monty <BR>
Python's  "Life of Brian."<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
eclipse@ultranet.com -- These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>
It was a typical net.exercise -- a screaming mob pounding on a greasy spot<BR>
on the pavement, where used to lie the carcass of a dead horse.<BR>
                  http://www.ultranet.com/~eclipse/<BR>
- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 11:51:03 -0700<BR>
From: cos 90 <cos90@powersurfr.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Cultures<BR>
<BR>
>If Earthship Ark and Red Dwarf had a fight, who would win?  :)<BR>
<BR>
Since as far as I know neither ship was armed, it would have to be<BR>
a ramming contest. Red Dwarf was 5 miles long. Each biosphere on the<BR>
Ark was 3 miles across in the series, 30 miles across in Ellison's<BR>
original treatment.<BR>
<BR>
We're looking at a collision between a locomotive and a child's toy, <BR>
here... :)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
     Glenn St-Germain  Edmonton, Alberta, Canada <BR>
cos90@powersurfr.com  http://plaza.powersurfr.com/glenn<BR>
        "There is no longer any normal to be"<BR>
                                 -- Gary Numan<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:11:20 -0600<BR>
From: Black ICE <wombat@premier.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Travshorts II<BR>
<BR>
Rupert Boleyn wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> On 9 Nov 99, at 15:08, Juliean Galak wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> > At 08:31 AM 11/9/99 -0600, you wrote:<BR>
> > > >Go ahead and laugh, human. The Electron Liberation Front will have it's<BR>
> > > >revenge!<BR>
> > ><BR>
> > >ELF, eh? I thought they were limited to aquatic operations.<BR>
> ><BR>
> > Mmm... Elf...  The other white meat....<BR>
> <BR>
> I always thought they counted as vegetable matter for dietary purposes.<BR>
<BR>
Only wood elves....<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>
"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 08:04:43 +1300<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Recovering disabled grav vehicles<BR>
<BR>
On 10 Nov 99, at 19:56, Steven Hudson wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >From: Robert Conley <estar@toolcity.net><BR>
> >Subject: Re: Recovering disabled grav vehicles<BR>
> ><BR>
> >Why do we need a separate vechile. Why can't we have a control module,<BR>
> >and a series of standard grav lift modules of which are self powered.<BR>
> >that you attach to the disabled vechile. The whole thing is controlled by<BR>
> <BR>
>   Is it just me, or isn't the issue of attaching these pods going to be<BR>
> non-trivial, and potentially pretty damned exciting with all the power<BR>
> cables running to the control module/crew cabin?<BR>
<BR>
That would probably depend on whether or not the nasty, bad people who <BR>
caused the 'breakdown' are still around.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 10:55:11 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Cultures<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 11:38 PM 11/10/1999 -0800, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>>Earthship Ark.  Had an actor that was later Chekov (SP?) didn't it?<BR>
><BR>
> If Earthship Ark and Red Dwarf had a fight, who would win?  :)<BR>
<BR>
The USS Warden (of Metamorphosis Alpha fame).<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 10:56:44 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Anti-violence groups in 3I<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> At 02:11 PM 11/11/1999 +0000, you wrote:<BR>
><BR>
>>Even better: hint to the PCs that killing innocent bystanders is <BR>
>>severely frowned upon in the world, then have the pacifist throw <BR>
>>themselves between the two groups between the fight, to stop the <BR>
>>bullets <grin>.<BR>
><BR>
> That might not work.<BR>
><BR>
> A few years ago, demonstrators were protested the shipment of arms to<BR>
> Central American from the Concord (Ca) Naval Weapons Depot.  One of the<BR>
> protestors sat on the tracks.  As the train approached at 35 mph.  They got<BR>
> it on video.<BR>
><BR>
> After the guy got out of the hospital, the public mood was "what kind of<BR>
> idiot sits in front of a moving train?"  That act didn't do anything to<BR>
> stop the shipments.<BR>
<BR>
Even sillier, it came out that (like far too much of the public) the<BR>
protestors weren't aware that the train *couldn't* stop in less than a<BR>
mile! <BR>
<BR>
We see this all the time here with people cutting in front of the<BR>
"light rail" trains. These may be a lot lighter than a frieght train,<BR>
but at any sort of speed they need a hundred yards or so to stop. <BR>
<BR>
Yet idiots cut *inches* in front of them all the time. And every few<BR>
months one of them gets hit. <BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: would be terrorists take over the ship and don't believe the<BR>
crew when they try to tell them that CG or no CG the ship *can't* do<BR>
whatever it is that the terrorists want to do. <BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 11:03:12 PST<BR>
From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Recovering disabled grav vehicles<BR>
<BR>
In mail you write:<BR>
<BR>
> Shadow wrote:<BR>
>> Wireless control on a battlefield is *not* a good idea. And<BR>
>> it's not as if using wires to connect the modules to the ARV is<BR>
>> going to be *that* much of a pain.<BR>
><BR>
> I suppose the "pain" issue depends on how  "hot"  the  recoveries<BR>
> are.<BR>
><BR>
> However, I wonder how easy it would be to  'simply  attach'  grav<BR>
> modules to a battle damaged vehicle.  Then there's the  issue  of<BR>
> bits  falling  off  mid-flight.   I  think  easiest  would  be  a<BR>
> specialised recovery vehicle looking like a hovering WW2  landing<BR>
> craft with a crane (to move the damaged vehicle and its bits onto<BR>
> it).  It could double up as a general utility combat cargo mover.<BR>
<BR>
Well, magnets are probably out. But I expect that at "contact" ranges,<BR>
you can make a CG or AG module attract the chunk of vehicle it's up<BR>
against strongly enough for all practical purposes. <BR>
<BR>
As for pieces falling off, that's why they issue you guys those *big*<BR>
rolls of duct tape. :-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>
 shadow@krypton.rain.com        <--preferred<BR>
leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com     <--last resort<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 12:04:57 -0900<BR>
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@gci.net><BR>
Subject: Re: (OT) IN TIME FOR REMEMBRANCE......<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>Any confusion is purely on your part. Carlos made it perfectly clear what it<BR>
>was about the post that he objected to. A further note: violence never<BR>
>actually happens in the Traveller Universe, as it is complete and total<BR>
>fiction. Violence - that which leaves mothers crying for their children, and<BR>
>that which leaves young men who have barely lived their lives screaming,<BR>
>dying, cold and afraid with their entrails steaming in the mud - only<BR>
>happens in the real world.<BR>
><BR>
No. Violence occurs, period. IMTU, gorry death is just as "Real" to the<BR>
characters as my High-School buddy Carl's scar on his forehead from his<BR>
failed attempt at suicide is to Carl and I. Just because I don't describe<BR>
the steaming entrails (or boiling away, for ex, on wypoc/regina/sm) doesn't<BR>
mean that, IMTU, it's not going to gross some character out. Just because<BR>
they are IMAGINARY to us doesn't make the sacrifices of the Imperial forces<BR>
in the 4th & 5th frontier wars any less the honored dead to the Characters.<BR>
<BR>
Now I agree with the post having been innapropriate for the TML, BUT<BR>
ABSOLUTELY DISAGREE with Carlos' reasons... Death in service is a fact of<BR>
life, a fact of fiction, and thus a subject of value to keep in mind as a<BR>
GM.<BR>
<BR>
Ob Trav: Is there an official rememberance of the fallen dead IYTU's? IMTU,<BR>
it's generally done at day 180. Not quite an imperial holiday (I only have<BR>
2 of those IMTU- Holiday and the Emperor's B-Day), but the official day of<BR>
rememberance.<BR>
<BR>
William F. Hostman  |  "Smith & Wesson: THe original Point and Click<BR>
interface!"<BR>
Aramis 0602 C55A364-C S kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge-<BR>
533<BR>
Mailto:aramis@gci.net http://home.gci.net/~aramis mailto:wilh@alaska.com<BR>
ICQ:14640742          AIM:AKAramis	ARM 1.0: 3 R H++ P+<BR>
IMTU 1.0: tc tm++ tn- t4-- tt+ to- tg-- ru+ ge 3i+ c+ jt-() au+ st- ls<BR>
pi+() ta+ he+(-) kk+ as+ hi+ dr+ va++(--) so+ zh++ vi+ da++ sy- ge- pi+<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 11:37:26 -0800<BR>
From: shudson@lightspeed.bc.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>
Subject: Re: Recovering disabled grav vehicles<BR>
<BR>
>From: Robert Conley <estar@toolcity.net><BR>
...<BR>
>>   Is it just me, or isn't the issue of attaching these pods going to be<BR>
>> non-trivial, and potentially pretty damned exciting with all the power<BR>
>> cables running to the control module/crew cabin?<BR>
><BR>
>No the modules are self-powered and the control is wireless. The<BR>
>performance wouldn't be as good as direct fiber optics but we are only<BR>
>talking about limping back to a repair center.<BR>
<BR>
  Self-powered how? Individual fusion units? If so, they'll be more costly<BR>
than a central unit with scale efficiencies.<BR>
<BR>
  What's the attachment method to the target AFV hull?<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:02:55 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Glenn Goffin <gmgoffin@yahoo.com><BR>
Subject: Recovering disabled grav vehicles<BR>
<BR>
>From: "Brandon Cope" <copeab@hotmail.com><BR>
<BR>
>the primary role (or at least a major role) of an ARV<BR>
<BR>
>(Armored Recovery Vehicle) is to take a damaged <BR>
>vehicle from where it was knocked out to where it can<BR>
<BR>
>be effectively repaired. This usually isn't much of a<BR>
<BR>
>problem with wheeled or tracked vehicles; as long as <BR>
>wheels or tracks or intact, you just tow it back.<BR>
<BR>
I think that you should be able to design a grav ARV<BR>
with enough Gs of lift to pick up another armored<BR>
vehicle.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
=====<BR>
<BR>
__________________________________________________<BR>
Do You Yahoo!?<BR>
Bid and sell for free at http://auctions.yahoo.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 14:17:46 -0500 (EST)<BR>
From: Michael Houghton <herveus@Radix.Net><BR>
Subject: Re: Travshorts II<BR>
<BR>
> On 9 Nov 99, at 15:08, Juliean Galak wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> > At 08:31 AM 11/9/99 -0600, you wrote:<BR>
> > > >Go ahead and laugh, human. The Electron Liberation Front will have it's<BR>
> > > >revenge!<BR>
> > ><BR>
> > >ELF, eh? I thought they were limited to aquatic operations.<BR>
> > <BR>
> > Mmm... Elf...  The other white meat....<BR>
> <BR>
> I always thought they counted as vegetable matter for dietary purposes.<BR>
> <BR>
Trolls consider elves to be ritually vegetable matter.<BR>
> <BR>
yours,<BR>
Michael<BR>
- -- <BR>
Michael and MJ Houghton   | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>
herveus@radix.net         | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>
Bowie, MD, USA            | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>
                          | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 13:13:40 -0600<BR>
From: "Joseph R. Dietrich" <yikes@evansville.net><BR>
Subject: Re: Cultures<BR>
<BR>
>If Earthship Ark and Red Dwarf had a fight, who would win?  :)<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
We all would, assuming they mutually destroyed one another.<BR>
<BR>
<ducking><BR>
<BR>
Ciao,<BR>
<BR>
Joseph R. Dietrich<BR>
yikes@evansville.net<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #1337<BR>
***********************************<BR>
<BR>
To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR>
<BR>
unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR>
<BR>
in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.imagiconline.com".<BR>
If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>
coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>
address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>
"local-traveller":<BR>
<BR>
subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR>
<BR>
A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>
subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>
in the commands above with "traveller".<BR>
<BR>
Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR>
</XMP></FONT><FONT  COLOR="#0f0f0f" BACK="#fffffe" SIZE=3 PTSIZE=10><BR>
<BR>
----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>
Return-Path: <owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
Received: from  rly-yd05.mx.aol.com (rly-yd05.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.5]) by air-yd01.mail.aol.com (v62.15) with ESMTP; Thu, 11 Nov 1999 16:48:47 -0500<BR>
Received: from  lists.imagiconline.com (lists.imagiconline.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yd05.mx.aol.com (v63.6) with ESMTP; Thu, 11 Nov 1999 16:48:31 -0500<BR>
Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>
	by lists.imagiconline.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id QAA72310;<BR>
	Thu, 11 Nov 1999 16:47:00 -0500 (EST)<BR>
	(envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com)<BR>
Received: by lists.imagiconline.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 11 Nov 1999 16:46:42 -0500<BR>
Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>
	by lists.imagiconline.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id QAA72259<BR>
	for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 11 Nov 1999 16:46:42 -0500 (EST)<BR>
	(envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com)<BR>
Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 16:46:42 -0500 (EST)<BR>
Message-Id: <199911112146.QAA72259@lists.imagiconline.com><BR>
From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>
To: traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #1337<BR>
Reply-To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
<BR>
</HTML>
